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Jorijn
none
Joined: 07 Dec 2005
Posts: 21
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 Posted: May 08, 2006 11:37pm Post subject: Whats the *meaning* of a stable network? |
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A lot of servers come and go, and most of the times new servers only will stand form aprox. 1 or 2 months. After then there sick of the low visitors count, and then they link there machine to some bigger network, or just shut it down.
So, what i'm asking is, when can you call yourself a stable network? Ofcourse its based on opinions, but is there a minimum time to exist, mimimum time of ircd uptime? You tell me  |
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Alek
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Joined: 14 Aug 2003
Posts: 24
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| Posted: May 09, 2006 12:45am Post subject: |
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| Personally, I think its when your network has been around more than about 6 months. I know my network was around about 3 months, maybe 4 before we registered with searchirc and that was a long time ago and we are still around. |
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Jorijn
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Joined: 07 Dec 2005
Posts: 21
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| Posted: May 09, 2006 4:59am Post subject: |
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I started November 2005, had my plans lying arround since Oktober 2005.
Personaly i think Unreal and Anope is a strong combination, sincs alot of networks are using it. Some say Unreal is a pain in the ass if it comes to a lot of users, but have users ever thought of the available HTM (High Traffic Mode) ?
Also networks that want to get big fast, link thereselfs to other networks they hardly know. If i know the owner a long time, it will defenetly make the decision more easyer for me.
Aftar all, the most networks will loose stabality if they start linking to unkown people, what will result in splits after some time. |
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Willaim
Lurker
Joined: 27 Jun 2003
Posts: 242
Location: IRC
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| Posted: May 09, 2006 7:27am Post subject: |
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Stability is having decent uptime with your network, decent opers that don't abuse/quit, loyal chatters, and an ircd that doesn't crash every week.
I've been using Unreal for quite some time (since pre 3.1.1 Komara) and I haven't had much segfaults recently, *crosses fingers*. By recently I mean since like 3.2 |
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Scire
Newbie
Joined: 14 Apr 2006
Posts: 84
Location: IRC
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| Posted: May 09, 2006 10:31am Post subject: |
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Stability comes from lots of things, imho its not one thing that makes your network 'stable'
Some things to look for should include uptime of the ircd(s), if it's linked how often it splits and for how long, the staff, the lenght of time the networks been around (imo if it has not been a year its not yet a 'stable' net)
Thats my stance anyway. 
/me starts Shameless promotion:
irc.sourcehack.org
Est. 4/2004
3 servers linked (since Est.)
5 Ops (3 server admins, 2 ircops) no change since Est.
IRCD uptime http://www.sourcehack.com/netstat.htm
/end shameless promotion  |
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Jorijn
none
Joined: 07 Dec 2005
Posts: 21
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| Posted: May 09, 2006 2:10pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | 22:09:59 •›› Raw (242): Server Up 112 days, 0:04:11
22:09:59 •›› Raw (219): u End of /STATS report. |
Thats a nice uptime |
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katsklaw
Guru
Joined: 28 Jun 2004
Posts: 1122
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| Posted: May 09, 2006 4:56pm Post subject: |
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| Jorijn wrote: | I started November 2005, had my plans lying arround since Oktober 2005.
Personaly i think Unreal and Anope is a strong combination, sincs alot of networks are using it. Some say Unreal is a pain in the ass if it comes to a lot of users, but have users ever thought of the available HTM (High Traffic Mode) ? |
HTM is not just an Unreal specific feature. Other ircd's that hold much larger amounts of clients on production networks, such as Bahamut also have this. I may be mistaken but I think hybrid/ratbox ircds do as well. Bahamut has held up to 40,000 connections on 1 ircd on a production network and hybrid/ratbox is used by EFnet which at the time of this post has roughly 78,000 users. Based on my info, no Unreal porduction network has hit close to those numbers. It's up to you wether you wish to count testnet numbers or not. Personally I don't count testnet figures simply for the fact that I feel that it's highly inprobable for any bot or series of bots to accurately emulate thousands of client connections from thousands of IP's and still be written within a known programing language and still have some practicality to it. Let alone the size of the codebase needed to emulate the total randomness of tens of thousands of users connecting to more than one server on the network. IMO, there are just too many variables required for an accurate test. However, that's just my opnion. I'm not suggesting that you only use Bahamut, hybrid or ratbox .. nor am I saying you should stay clear of Unreal ... Please use the ircd that you feel best suits your needs. I'm just simply sharing my opinion on what I think "stable" involves.
This could be part of ones definition of "stable" as well as what others have stated. Especially about uptime. Well, uptime is important to a certain level. Latency and splits play a big part as well. You can have 600 days up but if you have a crappy link with a higher than usual latency where your net splits every few hours .. then that 600 day uptime is a moot point.
I think what it all comes down to is individual preferences as to what "stable" is.
| Quote: | | Also networks that want to get big fast, link thereselfs to other networks they hardly know. If i know the owner a long time, it will defenetly make the decision more easyer for me. |
I'm glad I'm not the only one that feels this way  Anyway, enough babbling .. I hope this helped. |
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Aven
Idler
Joined: 05 Aug 2005
Posts: 393
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| Posted: May 09, 2006 8:12pm Post subject: |
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| To be honest, I think SearchIRC should only allow networks that have 30+ users. |
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Jorijn
none
Joined: 07 Dec 2005
Posts: 21
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| Posted: May 10, 2006 12:15am Post subject: |
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I agree to you katsklaw, i'm not saying other ircds dont have this function, as far as i know hybrid had it too.
what i'm saying some users dont even know it exists, and running 10.000 users on low traffix mode isnt going to help.
I know 2 'large' Unreal Networks:
Tweakers.net:
| Quote: | 08:08:27 •›› Raw (265): Current Local Users: 421 Max: 1015
08:08:27 •›› Raw (266): Current Global Users: 552 Max: 1191 |
Ninth-Gate:
| Quote: | 08:10:33 •›› Raw (265): Current Local Users: 56 Max: 242
08:10:33 •›› Raw (266): Current Global Users: 780 Max: 3642 |
Most of them are bots though
I know it isnt much compared to EFnet or Quakenet,
But its a start, and as you say, i'm experiencing strange lag on this networks, but i dont know if these owners haveHTM enabled. So i cant day it saved alot of lag. Just because i dont know the current status.
| Aven wrote: | | To be honest, I think SearchIRC should only allow networks that have 30+ users. |
Agreed, altough my own network will disappear from sirc, if its based on client connections, not global.
I think this plan will free the sirc database alot |
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Tranqerr
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Joined: 24 Mar 2005
Posts: 11
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| Posted: May 10, 2006 4:55pm Post subject: |
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I think a network is stable when you have 900+ users on average and less then 2 netsplits a month with 6 servers.
But thats probably just me
Oh..yeah... Using unreal and anope
Current Global Users: 924 Max: 3449 (only users!)
wowirc.com |
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HollyW00d
Lurker
Joined: 18 Apr 2004
Posts: 140
Location: IRC
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| Posted: May 10, 2006 4:57pm Post subject: |
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Well my Network uses UltimateIRCd - Best ircd ever. Stable as a rock. My hub has a 86+ day uptime and hasn't dropped yet. We also have a leaf with a 112 day uptime.
My network is rock solid.
HollyW00d
irc.SouthChat.Net
Exec. Dept. Chair |
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katsklaw
Guru
Joined: 28 Jun 2004
Posts: 1122
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| Posted: May 10, 2006 5:21pm Post subject: |
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| HollyW00d wrote: |
My network is rock solid.
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Ok .. I have to say it ... having 11 global users on any ircd is going to be solid. Hell, I can chat with 11 users on my cellphone.
Uptime isn't really a good definition of stability. I have a win2k box in the living room that the kids use for homework that has been running for more than 200 days .. but that doesn't mean that their homework box is more stable than your ircd server.
As far as stability I think you have to use a checklist like:(not in any order)
1> uptime
2> number of users
3> number of splits in a specific time frame
4> latency netwide or s2s depending on what your evaluating
5> the number of pingtimeouts you see from all users (yes I know there are some users that habitually timeout)
6> resource load on avg
7> latency during high traffic and highload times
8> etc.. etc..
#5 is assuming you have properly configured ping frequencies for all your users. |
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HollyW00d
Lurker
Joined: 18 Apr 2004
Posts: 140
Location: IRC
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| Posted: May 10, 2006 6:59pm Post subject: |
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| I'd be willing to bet that if youd stick over 1000 users on the network with just what we have wed still be the same. You don't necessarily need 1000+ users to know if your stable enough. I think if you have any brains you know your server and know what their capacity is. |
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katsklaw
Guru
Joined: 28 Jun 2004
Posts: 1122
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| Posted: May 10, 2006 7:31pm Post subject: |
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| HollyW00d wrote: | | I'd be willing to bet that if youd stick over 1000 users on the network with just what we have wed still be the same. You don't necessarily need 1000+ users to know if your stable enough. I think if you have any brains you know your server and know what their capacity is. |
Brains I think is the wrong term. Brains IMO indicates intelligence, however to know your server and its capacity requires wisdom and experience which is different. There is no definitave user count where stability lies. One really can't accurately say that if 1000 users was on a network .. then it's stable because then someone would wonder if 999 users are unstable. Case in point is DALnet. They peak upwards os 40,000 users and people still argue as to if it's stable or not. "Stable" is a very objective term that has a very personal definition.
My comment in regards to your user count was simply saying that 11 users isn't really a good number to use when factoring stable. 11 user hardly use any resources at all. Using 11 users as a basis for declaring stability would be like interviewing 3 people in New York City and declaring that New Yorkers love olives based on what 3 people said. Theres just not enough data to draw a conclusion.
I hope your net remains as stable at 1000 users as it does at 11.
ciao |
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HollyW00d
Lurker
Joined: 18 Apr 2004
Posts: 140
Location: IRC
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| Posted: May 10, 2006 8:15pm Post subject: |
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If you say so
lol |
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