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Triple_H
Newbie
Joined: 30 Oct 2003
Posts: 94
Location: IRC
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 Posted: Jun 23, 2004 7:35pm Post subject: Future of IRC |
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| To me i dont think the future for IRC is bright. Think about it, you spend YEARS building up a network to the point of something like Dalnet etc. All that hard work gets ruin because once you become a well known network you are also a well known target. All that hard work and you get ddosed or other bad things that happen around the internet. The future to me is basically Make a network and build it, then be made a target to jerks who want some "fun". |
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uchat
Idler
Joined: 17 Mar 2004
Posts: 335
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| Posted: Jun 23, 2004 8:07pm Post subject: |
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| Not all networks want to be the size of DALnet. |
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w00t
Eleet
Joined: 09 Jun 2004
Posts: 699
Location: Nowra, Australia
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| Posted: Jun 23, 2004 10:16pm Post subject: |
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It's as simple as this:
Once you focus on size, rather than good conversation (quantity rather than quality) You have already hit the downward size.
We have a room of 15 regulars who all genuinely enjoy each other's company. When someone new arrives, we size them up. If they fit, they fit. If they don't, if they don't leave of their own compunction... then... Who knows. We've never got to that point yet  |
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Triple_H
Newbie
Joined: 30 Oct 2003
Posts: 94
Location: IRC
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| Posted: Jun 23, 2004 10:30pm Post subject: |
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| Any network can get ddosed if they know its around. Im just saying a lot of people spend a lot of money paying for a network, only to waste it because of attacks. |
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Ashen
Idler
Joined: 05 Jan 2004
Posts: 285
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| Posted: Jun 27, 2004 2:14pm Post subject: |
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I can testify to this - my server just got DoSed yesterday and I have no idea why...... it seemed like a random attack according to the information I have.
Sometimes I think that just running an ircd at all means you are bound to get DoS'ed sooner or later.
-A |
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codemastr
Idler
Joined: 05 Feb 2004
Posts: 353
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| Posted: Jun 27, 2004 7:02pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | To me i dont think the future for IRC is bright. Think about it, you spend YEARS building up a network to the point of something like Dalnet etc. All that hard work gets ruin because once you become a well known network you are also a well known target. |
That's not IRC, that's life! Big fish make big targets. Go look up how many times McDonalds was sued last year. Then compare it to Lou's Burgers (a local place). I bet McDonalds will have 100x the number that Lou has. Now is this because McDonalds is a horrible company? Probably not, it's most likely because they have deep pockets. The fact that they are big makes them a more appealing target. If you sue McDonalds, you might become rich. If you sue Lou, he's just going to go out of business.
But, as many people said, what is so great about being a big network? What do you get out of it? Fame? Fortune? Women? No, No, and No. You really get nothing out of it at all, except problems. More users means more lag, more splits, more attacks, etc. So why concern yourself with making your network huge? That's what causes all the problems! I personally refuse to chat on networks that have more than a few thousand users. Everytime I go to EFNet, I'm there for about 30 mins and I see 4-5 splits. What's so great about that?
Instead of concerning yourself with the size of the network, worry about the quality. Make your network unique, so that users who are there have something that other networks do not have. If you concern yourself with getting more users, you'll only have more and more problems. |
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uchat
Idler
Joined: 17 Mar 2004
Posts: 335
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| Posted: Jun 27, 2004 7:50pm Post subject: |
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Now is this because McDonalds is a horrible company? Probably not, it's most likely because they have deep pockets.
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Not to mention billions of customers. No, BILLIONS is not inaccurate.
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But, as many people said, what is so great about being a big network? What do you get out of it? Fame? Fortune? Women? No, No, and No. You really get nothing out of it at all, except problems. More users means more lag, more splits, more attacks, etc. So why concern yourself with making your network huge? That's what causes all the problems! I personally refuse to chat on networks that have more than a few thousand users. Everytime I go to EFNet, I'm there for about 30 mins and I see 4-5 splits. What's so great about that?
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This is exactly why my target size for my network is about 6000 users. In an IRC sence I "grew up" on large nets ... prodominately DALnet (aka SPLITnet). I don't see that as fun chat as a user I can't stand fighting with NickServ over my own nick or waiting 5 minutes for a reply .. so as an Admin I look to keep that from my network.
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Instead of concerning yourself with the size of the network, worry about the quality. Make your network unique, so that users who are there have something that other networks do not have. If you concern yourself with getting more users, you'll only have more and more problems.
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I've spent many many hours tweaking my IRCd and Services .. loading different modules in both ... getting my network to be as close to what I would imagine a perfect net is .. yes I get the occasional user .. and I wish I had more .. but right this second I'm more worried about getting all my services lined up .. this includes charters, AUP's, MOTD's, website etc ...
In short I think codemastr hit it dead on. |
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aquanight
Lurker
Joined: 14 Jun 2004
Posts: 118
Location: Boise, ID
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| Posted: Jun 28, 2004 10:14am Post subject: |
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| codemastr wrote: | | I personally refuse to chat on networks that have more than a few thousand users. Everytime I go to EFNet, I'm there for about 30 mins and I see 4-5 splits. What's so great about that? |
Contradicting yourself there? First you say you don't go on big networks, then you turn around and say you go on one of the biggest nets around!
... or did I read that wrong?  |
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codemastr
Idler
Joined: 05 Feb 2004
Posts: 353
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| Posted: Jun 28, 2004 11:12am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Not to mention billions of customers. No, BILLIONS is not inaccurate. |
Good point. If you have a network of 50 users, the odds that one of them is a "bad guy" is less likely than finding 1 bad guy out of 50000 users. That's just simple probability. So the more users you have, the more likely one of them is a script kiddie.
| Quote: | | Contradicting yourself there? First you say you don't go on big networks, then you turn around and say you go on one of the biggest nets around! |
Well what I mean is, I don't go to those networks to chat. I only go there when I need some help or something where the smaller networks channels don't usually help. If you've ever been to a coding channel on IRC, you know 90% are idlers. When you have 100 people in the chan, it means you + 9 others are alive. When you go to one that only has 10 people, it means only you are alive (not very helpful). I go there, I just mean I don't go there to hang out and talk to friends. |
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DarkStorms
Newbie
Joined: 25 Jun 2004
Posts: 55
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| Posted: Jun 28, 2004 12:05pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | I've spent many many hours tweaking my IRCd and Services .. loading different modules in both ... getting my network to be as close to what I would imagine a perfect net is .. yes I get the occasional user .. and I wish I had more .. but right this second I'm more worried about getting all my services lined up .. this includes charters, AUP's, MOTD's, website etc ...
In short I think codemastr hit it dead on. |
I would love to go check your server out, I am the owner of DSnet, (DarkStorms) i got attacked by some of my neighbors users, so my 25 users went down to 15 and they havent come back yet, but.. My network is back up and running, our servers are linked, stats,services,samurai and my hub.. they al work, if you wouldnt mind giving me the addy to your network, i will go hang out there, heres my addy:
/server -m darkstorms.ath.cx 6660 |
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Ashen
Idler
Joined: 05 Jan 2004
Posts: 285
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| Posted: Jun 28, 2004 4:27pm Post subject: |
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| codemastr has indeed hit the nail on the head. |
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uchat
Idler
Joined: 17 Mar 2004
Posts: 335
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| Posted: Jun 28, 2004 6:14pm Post subject: |
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| DarkStorms wrote: | | Quote: | I've spent many many hours tweaking my IRCd and Services .. loading different modules in both ... getting my network to be as close to what I would imagine a perfect net is .. yes I get the occasional user .. and I wish I had more .. but right this second I'm more worried about getting all my services lined up .. this includes charters, AUP's, MOTD's, website etc ...
In short I think codemastr hit it dead on. |
I would love to go check your server out, I am the owner of DSnet, (DarkStorms) i got attacked by some of my neighbors users, so my 25 users went down to 15 and they havent come back yet, but.. My network is back up and running, our servers are linked, stats,services,samurai and my hub.. they al work, if you wouldnt mind giving me the addy to your network, i will go hang out there, heres my addy:
/server -m darkstorms.ath.cx 6660 |
irc.u-chat.org |
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w00t
Eleet
Joined: 09 Jun 2004
Posts: 699
Location: Nowra, Australia
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| Posted: Jun 29, 2004 6:40am Post subject: |
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| Ashen wrote: | | codemastr has indeed hit the nail on the head. |
He seems to do that with astonishing regularity. |
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codemastr
Idler
Joined: 05 Feb 2004
Posts: 353
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| Posted: Jun 29, 2004 11:08am Post subject: |
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Heh, after being a part of several networks that once they became big, began to die, you eventually start to see a pattern  |
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SupR
Guest
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| Posted: Jul 05, 2004 7:26pm Post subject: |
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I have to agree, the future of IRC does not look to bright, especially if nothing is done about the warez nets and script kiddies.
I'm not saying that warez should be eliminated, but networks that are up for warez only and nothing else should be taken down by their isp's
A warez chan or 2 isnt a prob, but networks that harbor theese channels and dont have anywhere that users can have an active chatroom are a problem.
Also, DDoS kiddies aka Script kiddies, well... do i really have to say anything? 
And, the last problem is power trips(note: i dont want to start an argument), all i'm going to say is that they can be lethal for irc networks,
however it is generally the script kiddies that go on power trips, so, no script kiddies = reduced power trips .
Thanks,
SupR
Elite-IRC Network Founder |
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