|
|
| Author |
Message |
Jamie
none
Joined: 06 May 2005
Posts: 36
|
 Posted: May 21, 2005 11:53am Post subject: |
 |
|
I've moved the rest of my post here.
- Jamie O. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Roku
Newbie
Joined: 18 Apr 2005
Posts: 92
|
| Posted: May 21, 2005 12:12pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Jamie wrote: | Roku:
Why would you defend a product you apparently dislike?
|
Because it's a good product, made by good people. I'm thankful for everything they have done for me and IRC in general.
Lets no be so narrow minded as to think that just because I dislike something that I think it's total trash.
| Quote: |
Hitler had the ability to execute his ideals, and he did. People actually liked his attitude, so much that in every greet they'd "heil" him. People respect him even today because of his ability. The ability to turn a floundering country into one of the most powerful of its time.
|
Yes this is why most of the world wanted to kill him including millions of Jews. He brainwashed his fellow countrymen into seeing things his way.
| Quote: |
To use your political reference, this explains why Bush was re-elected. |
Bush was re-elected because his "we will get it done" attitude and he acted upon that very positive attitude.
| Quote: |
People like other people who sound positive, regardless of what they can do (or have done). Of course, this is incorrect.
|
You should then try to explain why people are so motivated by motivational speakers. Such as Zig Zigler. It's his positive attitude. People buy the products that his tapes endorse because of it. In most cases he doesn't have anything to do with the product it's self.
| Quote: |
I don't see the point of your reference to Einstein. Did you mean something like: "When Olene's gone, we'll finally understand her views of the world and IRC in general?"
|
The reference was to how people of his time viewed him. He barely has a 6th grade eduction and failed most of his tests becuse he was daydreaming. Those "actions" gave him the label.
I don't know what olene will turn out to be .. no one does .. what I do know is I won't use anything she ever writes because of her negative attitude.
| Quote: |
By the way, I'm not using a "PC."
|
Don't be critical, you know my meaning. Apple's are PC's too "PC" means Personal Computer and has nothing to do with a specific vendor.
Last edited by Roku on May 21, 2005 12:16pm; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
[DiMENSiON]
Eleet
Joined: 06 Sep 2003
Posts: 621
|
| Posted: May 21, 2005 12:14pm Post subject: |
|
|
| if you're not using a Personal Computer what are you using, a global computer that everyone shares simultaniously? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Jamie
none
Joined: 06 May 2005
Posts: 36
|
| Posted: May 21, 2005 12:24pm Post subject: |
|
|
Getting something done is an ability, not an attitude. To reiterate: Just because something has a "positive attitude," doesn't mean it's the best thing to go with.
I've no idea why people are so enthralled by positive attitudes. Talk is cheap.
Do you even operate a network? If you did, you should pick server software because of its ability, not the attitude of the people, or person who produced it. Each to his own, I suppose.
By the way, "PC" is usually used when describing a stock, out-of-the-box, IBM clone.
- Jamie O. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
[DiMENSiON]
Eleet
Joined: 06 Sep 2003
Posts: 621
|
| Posted: May 21, 2005 12:33pm Post subject: |
|
|
a pc is used in reference to a computer system, don't try and think you're all special  i built my own personal computer not bought one.
Regardless if you use mac, linux, windows or any other o/s. it's still a personal computer if you use it for personal use.  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Jamie
none
Joined: 06 May 2005
Posts: 36
|
| Posted: May 21, 2005 12:40pm Post subject: |
|
|
Excellent.
However, if you walked into any computer store and asked for a "PC," I'd be willing to bet you one million dollars that they'd direct you to the IBM clone section of the store.
Why? Because going back ~fifteen years ago, the clueless authors of general computer books mostly ignored the Apple, and then Macintosh platforms. Take it up with them!
- Jamie O. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
[DiMENSiON]
Eleet
Joined: 06 Sep 2003
Posts: 621
|
| Posted: May 21, 2005 12:43pm Post subject: |
|
|
| yes. but go into a shop and ask for a bar of cholocate they'd most likely show you a Cadburys (or hershey if you're american) but that doesn't mean other cocoa based products arn't chocolate. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Roku
Newbie
Joined: 18 Apr 2005
Posts: 92
|
| Posted: May 21, 2005 12:46pm Post subject: |
|
|
Jamie, you're probably right. However, it was mostly done out of ignorance. If I may be so bold, sharing/spreading that ignornance makes you like them.
Just like the terms hacker and cracker. Making people ignorant is a mistake. Keeping them ignorant is stupid and dangerous.
Anyway, back to the topic.
| Quote: |
Do you even operate a network? If you did, you should pick server software because of its ability, not the attitude of the people, or person who produced it. Each to his own, I suppose.
|
Yes I do own a network. One small thing your forgetting is that several of them run nearly the same. They are all basiclly following the same RFC. It's been stated many times over here and elsewhere that it's not the software that makes the network popular .. it's how welcome the user feels when they are connected. If the software dictated if a network was popular then we'd have about 2000 networks running Unreal/Anope that don't need to advertise what they do differently but simply mntion that they use Unreal and watch the users flock. It just doesn't work that way. Popularity is deeper than what you have but how you present it.
Therefore I have the freedom to "choose" the one I wish to use. Generally I have daily contact with the software venders and if we can't work together, I move to a different product. It's that simple.
Last edited by Roku on May 21, 2005 12:55pm; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Jamie
none
Joined: 06 May 2005
Posts: 36
|
| Posted: May 21, 2005 12:54pm Post subject: |
|
|
I'm not spreading any "ignornance." I stand by my original statement, so weks.
What would you define those terms as ("hacker" and "cracker")?
- Jamie O. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Roku
Newbie
Joined: 18 Apr 2005
Posts: 92
|
| Posted: May 21, 2005 12:57pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Jamie wrote: | I'm not spreading any "ignornance." I stand by my original statement, so weks.
What would you define those terms as ("hacker" and "cracker")?
- Jamie O. |
hacker = a person that takes full advantage of a computer finding weaknesses in the code and "playing" with it's abilities.
cracker = same as hacker except uses such knowledge to perform illegal acts.
Seems to come back to actions doesn't it  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
[DiMENSiON]
Eleet
Joined: 06 Sep 2003
Posts: 621
|
| Posted: May 21, 2005 1:21pm Post subject: |
|
|
| i prefer the term: wanker. for what you call 'cracker' |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Jamie
none
Joined: 06 May 2005
Posts: 36
|
| Posted: May 21, 2005 1:33pm Post subject: |
|
|
Actually, a "hacker" is a person who sits in front of a terminal and programmes without prior thought.
A "cracker" is a person who (illegally) gains access to a computer, and then does indecent things with it.
Apparently people think "hacker" sounds cooler than "cracker." This is where the confusion started from.
I believe the quote went something like "hackers build, whilst crackers destroy."
I also wonder if this thread will ever get back on topic.
- Jamie O. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Roku
Newbie
Joined: 18 Apr 2005
Posts: 92
|
| Posted: May 21, 2005 1:39pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Jamie wrote: | Actually, a "hacker" is a person who sits in front of a terminal and programmes without prior thought.
|
You asked my definition, not for me to give you yours. Definitions vary from person to person. However I did find this (which defines my definition better than I did).
| Code: |
The New Hacker's Dictionary, a hacker can be defined as:
A person who enjoys exploring the details of programmable systems and how to stretch their capabilities, as opposed to most users, who prefer to learn only the minimum necessary.
One who programs enthusiastically (even obsessively) or who enjoys programming rather than just theorizing about programming.
A person capable of appreciating hack value.
A person who is good at programming quickly.
An expert at a particular program, or one who frequently does work using it or on it.
An expert or enthusiast of any kind. One might be an astronomy hacker, for example.
One who enjoys the intellectual challenge of creatively overcoming or circumventing limitations.
[deprecated] A malicious meddler who tries to discover sensitive information by poking around. Hence `password hacker', `network hacker'. The correct term for this sense is cracker.
|
With that I've said my opinion, take it as you will.
good day. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
angelic
Lurker
Joined: 01 Aug 2003
Posts: 148
|
| Posted: May 21, 2005 1:53pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Jamie wrote: | Do you even operate a network? If you did, you should pick server software because of its ability, not the attitude of the people, or person who produced it. Each to his own, I suppose.
- Jamie O. |
What you think people should do and what they actually do are two entirely different things.
I don't support products (all encompassing) if i don't agree with the base ethics. It's why i don't run windows, it's why i buy my eggs and meat from a local free range farmer, it's why i moved banks, it's why i leave irc network or don't even connect. Sometimes there is no choice, granted, but exceedingly ethics are the _only_ things that make products and services different. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
angelic
Lurker
Joined: 01 Aug 2003
Posts: 148
|
| Posted: May 21, 2005 2:22pm Post subject: |
|
|
| olene wrote: | | First of all, the only reason I posted that here was because there was absolutely no one in the client's official channel besides a bot keeping the channel open. |
There's an email addy and bug submission procedure on the website. The guys don't check these forums, i know because i too went to the channel, it had about 20 people idling there, i stuck around for a few hours and low and behold someone showed up.
| Quote: | | If someone posted some review like this on sirc, and i read it, this entire problem wouldn't have happened in the first place, so i posted it (in the chat forum no less, since there wasn't even a client forum) in hopes that it would be useful. |
Useful how? You did not list one positive aspect of the client, and i don't believe there wasn't even one. You even "reviewed" an old version.
| Quote: | | I'm not bashing the client. |
Oh really? Our definitions must be very different then.
| Quote: | | I'm bashing it because it failed to work with at least three different ircd's, |
| Quote: | In other news...
I'm sorry if I came off as a bitch. I highly doubt any of you even use bersirc in the first place.. so you're not defending it against my review, you're defending your forum against me. Which sucks. |
Why exactly does it suck? Because people tell you this kind of posting isn't the way we want a community forum to work? Because once upon a time these forums used to be a place net admins could come and share ideas and views, to debate and discuss in a civilised manner, to learn and teach, and feel encouraged and inspired by others who felt passionately about IRC and some of us are _sick_ of you posting only negative, snide and pointless threads and rather than sit back and allow it to continue we ask you to take a step back and _think_ about what you post and why you post it and if adds value to IRC or if it is merely you whining again.
Please don't mistake me olene, i am not saying you can't criticise or offer feedback in these forums, you can, of course. But when all you do is point out what you perceive to be flaws and nothing else it becomes old.
As far as i can see you installed an old version, you didn't even quote the version you installed, you set out to find faults, you didn't use it long enough to get used to its differences and you didn't give the devs any opportunity to discuss your points.
That's not a review, it's a witch hunt.
| Quote: | | I posted something negative because I thought it would be of use to someone. If i sent it to the developer(s) of bersirc, theyd read it, possibly throw it away, and no one would find it useful besides them. |
First of all that's some massive assumptions you're making there. Perhaps you "throw away" the feedback you receive for your projects but don't assume everyone does.
As for people finding it useful, the first thing i do when i'm considering switching software is check the website and the bugtracker. I look how active the project it, what bugs are being reported and how they are handled. I recently switched to kvirc and i didn't come onto the sirc forums and search for people's opinions. I did just what i said.
| Quote: | I'm not a bitch. I'm a cute and cuddly lil girl. Or at least I wish.
I didn't write this review BEFORE i use bersirc; so don't criticize me, my attitude, or even my style BEFORE you know me. |
I know the "you" that you portray on these forums. That's all. And while part of me has sympathy for you, another part can't be arsed.
I think in a couple of years time you'll think about these threads and the way you carried yourself and cringe. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
| |
Register
Log in
