Find services type

Rob_ · Idler Joined: 13 Dec 2003 Posts: 309

hey,

You know how you now index the most popualr ircd's your bot's find is there any chance you could do the same for services? i'd be farily intrested in the results, dunno about anyone else :P

Rob

DjMadness- · Newbie Joined: 10 Jan 2004 Posts: 70

Jason · Posted: Feb 12, 2004 6:24pm Post subject:

This isn't likely to happen. There is no universal command to see what services (if any) there are on a network. Any new type of service would automatically not be included unless there was some convention for finding out services name.

Rob_ · Idler Joined: 13 Dec 2003 Posts: 309

well, a /version <server name> would work, but identifying which server is the services server may be trickey... a /links then a /version <server> (on all of them) and then assuming that any server which didnt match the version reply of your local ircd is infact a service? (as the network's ircds should match) granted this wont be 100% acurate, but it isnt going to be too far off... just a thought :)

as a side note, on networks where user's are allowed to issue a /stats u (or is it /stats U) to view ulines, would then tell you the exact name of any services servers which could then be versioned :)

U · Eleet Joined: 18 Jun 2003 Posts: 521 Location: IRC

I could see some networks not wanting this ability and taking steps to not show version.

Anope about a week ago suddenly had a major exploit. I wouldn't want someone to have the ability to find out about it, come here, list networks by services type, and go on a free for all using that list and getting networks not aware of the change yet.

If this feature was ever implemented, I would take steps to put a fake version reply on my services (and its possible already via a module) to ensure that nobody would have a clue for that very reason.

Rob_ · Idler Joined: 13 Dec 2003 Posts: 309

Im not suggesting listing who uses what, merely the number of ppl using whatever - just like they do for ircd's already on here, it holds exactly the same secuirty issues, do you already hide your ircd version so it isnt counted by the ircd counter which is already used by searchirc?

Maybe i wasnt clear what i meant in my first post, if so sorry.

Re: the anope module, i know it is possible for a module to do, i wrote most of anopes module support, and an example module which hides version replys to non-opers.

If noone likes the idea fair enough, it was merely a suggestion (this is a suggestions board after all), but just say "i dont like it", there is little need to post saying what a security risk it would be, without actually thinking about what the real issues with it are. I fail to see how knowing that 700 networks use IRC Services 5.x and 10 networks use Anope 1.5.x is a security issue for anyone at all.

Rob

Jason · Posted: Feb 13, 2004 9:44am Post subject:

If you didn't already notice, while there is an ircd version page that shows the ircd version count, you cannot use that to then find out all networks that run the specific ircd. Thus if there was an exploit out, you couldn't then easily find all networks running it.

Keep in mind that not only do some networks mask ircd version, some have /links completely disabled (I personally think this isn't the brightest thing to do, for several reasons, but that's beyond the scope of this thread), many have /stats disabled for non opers, etc. I've also found a large number of networks monitor user commands, which is why the SearchIRC index robot gets so quickly klined on some smaller networks who see a client connecting, doing /motds, /links, then /list. Adding a bunch of remote /versions is going to compound the problem, not help.

We don't mind suggestions - keep them coming :)

angelic · Lurker Joined: 01 Aug 2003 Posts: 148

I think the point of the suggestion has been lost or misinterpreted here. Lots of people ask me which services to use, which are the best, who uses what and if this suggestion was implemented it would be a good resource for people (imo), just as i assume people look at the stats on ircd usage.

I don't think it was intended to be a means of people discovering which services networks use, and i don't think we should be ruling out suggestions simply because it could be abused. Anything is open to abuse.

I plainly state on my nets website which IRCd and services we use, as i've seen a lot of other networks do. It's not something i've ever thought of hiding.

i believe there is a use for this kind of function, if you think the negatives outweigh the positives then fair enough.

Just a comment about the searchirc bots being banned, i think this is purely down to people not knowing what the bot is and does, when i first saw it join my net i googled straight away, but i'm a girl, i'm nosy, a lot of people are (rightly?) paranoid.

Jason · Posted: Feb 13, 2004 11:59pm Post subject:

The main site is geared towards end users more than network administrators. That isn't to say that there isn't stuff for admins here -- there is, and there will be more coming, but stuff like a big list of all the services isn't going to help 99% of the visitors to SearchIRC, including the admins.

acidrain · none Joined: 09 Mar 2004 Posts: 9

Well in a way its kinda pointless.. maybe a section suggesting good services or something, and like Jason said alot of places have /links and map blocked, and if it isn't most places have services server hidden in links/map.

could also have it for future registrations ask what services used "Auspice, ircservices, gnuworld, anope, epona, other" type of thing, it wouldnt show up on the network page, but in a stats page like rob said, would be less complicated, and could see how many people use what